Chris's Wiki :: blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperiment Commentshttps://utcc.utoronto.ca/~cks/space/blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperiment?atomcommentsDWiki2012-01-02T18:58:33ZRecent comments in Chris's Wiki :: blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperiment.From 190.148.179.56 on /blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperimenttag:CSpace:blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperiment:576c5310f5887144669277e392edba2baf487356From 190.148.179.56<div class="wikitext"><p>What I'd really to see instead is a better standarized (well defined) middle button behaviour. As a first choice I would have liked copy/paste assigned, that would be great; but for it to work properly on all platforms(/apps) it would need an extra button (totaling 4). This is useful even if your not a dev(/con lover); since word processing is such a commomly mayor user function.</p>
<p>If not; then I'd liked it followed by navigational commands (back/forward, or prev/next); that sadly require an extra button too. Although they could be implemented as a toggle, or double click; ie, first middle click copies selection, second (or double) pastes content.</p>
<p>And as a last alternative; I'd to further the continuation of the de facto open new tabs functionality. Except that now be it extended to open new windows, when no tabs are available. And of course, assuming multiple instances are allowed. </p>
<p>But in the bitter end perhaps the best way is the user configurable set. OSes such have defaults that can be easly overriden by users. Followed by programmable application specific controls. And of course, other virtual key combos; eg, 1st+2nd->3; 1st+3rd->4, etc. </p>
<p>PS: I personally found the scroll wheel as a poor and half harted implementation of the org devised fine tracking mechanism. Ie, (as in the first and second suggestions where's the dual?) There should be another for horizontal scrolling (2nd axis); but if you're going to put that, then might as well aptly put the second extra trackball. In this context, the zoom/panning mech of the middle button without the wheel works better; since the latter only would get in the way. Obv problem is design; bundling together the wheel and middle buttons was clever; yet (like you aptly point out) not very irl practical.</p>
</div>2012-01-02T18:58:33ZFrom 216.131.32.163 on /blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperimenttag:CSpace:blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperiment:1231257360796118e6870f71e2c5ddff5f254c2fFrom 216.131.32.163<div class="wikitext"><p>Sorry, didn't see the comments page before I posted that. Please feel free to delete.</p>
</div>2011-11-21T12:31:36ZFrom 216.131.32.163 on /blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperimenttag:CSpace:blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperiment:0ef7d0532bfd9f6da047882f0421b679cf6dfc10From 216.131.32.163<div class="wikitext"><p>There are a lot of scroll wheel mice that let you click the scrollwheel. I dunno, you might be a purist though.</p>
</div>2011-11-21T12:30:26ZBy Chris Siebenmann on /blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperimenttag:CSpace:blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperiment:46eff31799908584a03044287b6c5ff341f2afe0Chris Siebenmann<div class="wikitext"><p>The short version is that scroll wheels are in a fundamental conflict
with button functionality such that one or the other of them pretty
much has to lose. I use the middle mouse button much more than a scroll
wheel, so I optimize for the mouse button.</p>
<p>The long version, with an actual explanation and argument for this,
is in <a href="https://utcc.utoronto.ca/~cks/space/blog/tech/MouseButtonVsScrollWheel">MouseButtonVsScrollWheel</a>.</p>
</div>2011-11-21T05:50:35ZFrom 85.179.193.103 on /blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperimenttag:CSpace:blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperiment:7c5a29fff1424118a827ce31f9c083fe84b0ef40From 85.179.193.103<div class="wikitext"><p>I don't understand exactly what you are aiming for? Is it something haptical, to want to have the wheel separated? Because, you know? I can push my scrollwheel down an have this interpreted as third button without any xinput messing. Came like this by default. Some old Logitech Dinosaur :)</p>
</div>2011-11-21T03:11:26ZFrom 134.173.34.85 on /blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperimenttag:CSpace:blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperiment:810cb8e8760c3f988d43f7a02b6f5c4ee9ed6be8From 134.173.34.85<div class="wikitext"><p>I've had Kensington trackballs on my machines (Mac and Linux) since 1996 or so, and I love them. I recently got a <a href="http://www.kensington.com/kensington/us/us/p/1444/K72327US/slimblade%e2%84%a2-trackball.aspx">Slimblade trackball</a> to replace a 10-year old Expert Mouse that died, and it's pretty nice. It has four actual buttons that you can set up however you want, as well as allowing you to twist the ball to scroll. I found it a bit weird at first, but it works really well and I've gotten very used to it. It's not as programmable on the Mac as the previous trackball was, but it should be about the same for Linux as that one was (so you could program all the buttons and the scrolling to do whatever you want them to).</p>
<p>[Before I got the Slimblade, I tried using a Magic Trackpad when the old trackball died, and it's great for lots of things (in Mac OS X), but I found that it had some problems in my setup that led me to get the trackball. The key is that I have a <a href="http://www.salli.com/default.asp?siteid=en&id=Accessories_Nipsu_usa">Salli Nipsu</a> support -- a leather-covered raised platform that holds my arms above my keyboard and provides a handy place off to the side for my mouse/trackball. Because of the distance I had to reach to operate the trackpad, I had some cramping that seemed carpal-tunnel like. The trackpad also doesn't click well on anything but a hard surface, so that was causing additional strain. Now I have both, and use whichever one feels right for a particular job (and can move the trackpad closer in if I'm doing a lot of Apple-style scrolling or gesturing).]</p>
<p>Claire</p>
</div>2011-11-17T18:45:49ZFrom 195.26.247.141 on /blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperimenttag:CSpace:blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperiment:76fb228a970dd65a513391a1ddd03c8dbfff7bc5From 195.26.247.141<div class="wikitext"><p>I have a Griffin PowerMate and it works fine on Linux, as there's a fancypants open source driver that lets you control the LEDs in the base of it too. I wouldn't really recommend it as a scroll wheel though, as it's more like a volume knob so it would seems a bit strange for a vertical scroll control.</p>
</div>2011-11-16T13:21:47ZFrom 92.75.47.140 on /blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperimenttag:CSpace:blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperiment:cd4cffe1a925339a5fadb4ddc212eacf2741e831From 92.75.47.140<div class="wikitext"><p>After toying around for 15min with Xinput, I now reread the post and notice how you disabled the tracking. :)</p>
</div>2011-11-15T23:24:31ZBy Chris Siebenmann on /blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperimenttag:CSpace:blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperiment:19d3621097634fc7f672b95e0a47a9ab2b59dd1cChris Siebenmann<div class="wikitext"><p>On the PowerMate: I don't think I'm keen enough yet on the scroll wheel
experiment to actually buy dedicated hardware for it. The attraction
so far is that we have plenty of standard USB scroll wheel mice just
sitting around, so it's easy to grab one to play around with.</p>
<p>The problem for me with things like the Logitech keyboards is that
I have very particular tastes in keyboards; I would far rather have
my favorite keyboard and no scroll wheel than vice versa. I see the
attraction to people who are less particular, though. (I sometimes
wish that I was one of them, it would make life easier. Especially
now that my keyboard is out of production.)</p>
</div>2011-11-15T23:04:48ZFrom 132.183.156.105 on /blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperimenttag:CSpace:blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperiment:f49dcbe73ef494d0b49e16b2df3e41443364a1eeFrom 132.183.156.105<div class="wikitext"><p>Hi! A while ago Griffin Technology made a device called the PowerMate, which sounds like what you are looking for. I'm not sure if it works on Linux, and it would only be available second hand, but maybe it's worth a look?</p>
</div>2011-11-15T14:39:17ZBy trs80 on /blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperimenttag:CSpace:blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperiment:7d0208d7082d28f9aa619c069eceb55d2344c12ctrs80<div class="wikitext"><p>Logitech have made keyboards with scroll wheels on the left hand edge - I use them at work and home, they're quite useful IMHO.</p>
</div>2011-11-15T12:50:04ZBy gsauthof on /blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperimenttag:CSpace:blog/sysadmin/ScrollMouseExperiment:99da08e673c5e2b127d533c9d2d4ada1c44330e6gsauthof<div class="wikitext"><p>I am a big <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pointing_stick">pointing stick</a> fan. But on a desktop system I use a 3-button mouse with a scrollpoint, like <a href="http://www.amazon.com/IBM-3-Button-Scrollpoint-Optical-Mouse/dp/B00007DTC6/">this IBM one</a>. IMHO it is a far superior interface design than scroll wheels.</p>
<p>(It actually has 3 buttons and a separate stick for scrolling on top - you don't have to 'click' a scroll-wheel down or something like that.)</p>
<p>In addition to good usability it has advantages in shared offices because you don't get all these 'ratch-ratch-ratch-ratch-ratch ...' scroll-wheel noises any more ...</p>
</div>2011-11-15T09:20:23Z